Sport
30 October, 2025
The full interview with QRIC deputy commissioner Kim Kelly
A Q&A with the boss of Queensland racing integrity, Kim Kelly.
This is the full transcript between North West Weekly editor Matt Nicholls and Queensland Racing Integrity Commission (QRIC) deputy commissioner Kim Kelly in response to criticism from the Outback racing industry about changes to the heat policy. You can read that article HERE.
MN: Kim, I've had some concerns from clubs and participants in western Queensland about what they believe is a shifting of the goalposts on the heat policy. Can you clarify what your position is in regards to the heat policy and if there are any changes being made?
KK: There's no major changes to the policy. What we've done is we've redefined it. It's called the Adverse Weather Policy rather than the Heat Policy because it just doesn't handle high temperatures. It handles matters like lightning, hail, heavy rain and flooding, fire and other conditions and weather-related hazards. So there's more than just hot weather that clubs and stewards and participants have to face on a seasonal basis, particularly in Queensland with such a vast area. But I suppose in respect of the clubs and the matter that you're dealing with or speaking to, I guess it primarily centres around that heat policy. And I wouldn't say that there's major changes, but what we have tried to do is clarify matters and put measures in place that can, wherever possible, facilitate the race meeting being held. It needs to be stressed that QRIC’s position is that we will do whatever we can within our powers to make sure that a race meeting is conducted, but never at the expense of the welfare of the animals or the safety of the participants. That's our overarching obligation is to those areas. But in saying that, we'll work with industry, work with Racing Queensland, work with whoever to make sure that wherever possible a race meeting is conducted.
I just want to clarify something. You said that the Heat Policy has been changed to an Adverse Weather Policy. Has that been passed or is that still under review? Because I can't find that online.
No, we're just in the final stages of ... we've sought comment from Racing Queensland on behalf of the clubs and they've provided some input into that. And now it's just a case of, we've just got to incorporate certain things that have been recommended to us … I would expect that toward tomorrow or in the early part of next week that we'd have something ready to be put up on the website and ready to be digested by industry and by the public.
So you're saying that QRIC and, I guess, Racing Queensland in part, is almost policing this new policy or enacting this new policy before it's even been released to the racing community?
I wouldn't say that we've enacted it as such but there's measures that we put in place, particularly in respect of Ipswich last week, knowing that there was going to be a spike in temperatures last Thursday, and there was going to be an extremely hot day on Monday.
But it was hotter at Ipswich on Monday than it was on the original Thursday.
Yes, it was. Yeah, for sure. And I'll take you through those specific instances shortly. But irrespective of whether this policy had gone up last week or it goes up next week, we would have been remiss in our obligations, derelict in our obligations, if we just sat back and did nothing because a certain policy hadn't, or a policy document hadn't been posted to the website by a certain date. So, irrespective of whether that policy was up on the website, the fact that the Ipswich Turf Club and Racing Queensland were contacted about those matters was absolutely the right thing to do in order for welfare and safety to be protected.
One of the conditions of the existing policy says: “Modification or cancellation of a race program in advance can only be effected by Racing Queensland in consultation with QRIC stewards". Now, my understanding is that QRIC virtually has no authority on race meetings until race day. Is that correct or incorrect?
No, that's incorrect. We take charge of the actual race meeting on race day, but we are an integral aspect of the process leading up to that. And Matt, it'd be a nonsense argument to say, 'oh, well, QRIC don't take over until Saturday'. And we know that Saturday is going to be 42 degrees, so we'll do nothing until Saturday. And then we'll call the race meeting off on Saturday morning because it's going to be 42. That would be nonsensical and it would just cause so much disruption. So what we try and do is, and I think we do it very effectively, is work with industry in the lead up to that race meeting to ensure that the best outcome is able to be achieved on the day, rather than waiting for the day and then saying, oh, well, even though this was forecast for about the last four days, we don't take control of the meeting until the morning of the race meeting, so we're calling it off now. There's no common sense in that.
I'll take you through the specific instances of Ipswich last week. So last Monday week, it was forecast on Thursday to be 38. Now that was a spike in temperature that was that was foreshadowed. And because of that, we contacted Racing Queensland, not to put them on notice, but just to foreshadow, the forecast is for 38, that's going to be a noticeable spike in the temperature. Horses haven't been subject to that in the lead up to that time. Let's look at what options are available for that, given the temperature of the forecast temperature of 38, I think it was. There was a process that was undertaken between Racing Queensland, the club, QRIC, and it was decided that it wasn't in the best interest of the meeting to change the race time, rather to put it back to Monday. So that was the decision that was made.
That's not a QRIC decision. The QRIC input into that was to foreshadow that it was going to be very hot and see what options are available to ensure that the race meeting was able to continue, whether at a different time, whether at the same time, if there was a change in forecast or whether there was a change in day, that was to be decided down the track. Now, ultimately, it was decided to move the race meeting to Monday and then, as fate would have it, the forecast kept toning down the heat for the day (on Thursday). But the decision had already been made at that stage to transfer the race meeting to Monday. Now on Saturday, it became apparent again that Monday was going to be another very hot day. So QRIC again contacted Racing Queensland and it was decided at that time to look at our options in regards to race times for Monday, to see what could happen. We had hoped that that might be able to be delayed until Sunday.
It wasn't able to be done on Sunday. It had to be done by about midday on Saturday, so that all parties were aware of the situation. And as it turned out, whether it was Saturday or Sunday made no difference because Monday was a very hot day and it was decided to bring the race meeting forward. The first race was a bit after 9am. So they're the type of measures, the type of mitigation measures that are in place and that are available to clubs and the industry to make sure that the race meeting is able to go ahead without compromising those matters that I referred to earlier.
I just want to focus on western Queensland. This Saturday we've got Barcaldine and Cloncurry racing. Yesterday (Wednesday) Racing Queensland put an update out saying that Barcaldine would start at 10 o'clock, which has upset a lot of people at Barcaldine, but there's no advice yet for Cloncurry. At this stage, can you advise what time Cloncurry will be starting on Saturday?
No, I can't. Matt, I'm not aware of that situation.
This is coming from the Barcaldine Race Club, but the president said that they contacted Racing Queensland on Monday, advising that there was going to be hot weather. They've agreed with Racing Queensland that a 12 o'clock start was preferable and they would try to finish the race meeting before 2pm. They have a turf track, which is obviously not as hot as a dirt track, and they're well shaded and well equipped, being one of the major clubs in the region. QRIC has apparently, according to Barcaldine Race Club, intervened and said, ‘no, you have to start at 10 o'clock’. That presents problems for the race club because there's a Qantas flight that lands at 11 o'clock on Saturday that would bring in jockeys and also the vet. So they've now had to put a vet on an overnight bus to make sure the meeting goes ahead. Why would QRIC overrule the race club and the racing body in that instance?
I'm not aware of that specific circumstance Matt so I'd have to I'd have to contact the various stewards and whatnot in respect of those matters and seek clarification on those matters, so I'm not in a position to comment at this time, but I will be in a position to comment on it later today once I have obtained all the information.
(Kim Kelly later called back – his response is further down)
I guess the other question I have about the policy is that, as it stands, the Heat Policy is very ambiguous. There is no set temperature or wet bulb reading for when it would be appropriate to move a meeting or call one off. There are mitigation measures at 35 degrees and then at 38 degrees, but right now, there's no policy saying when a meeting can or can't go ahead. In the Central West and North West, temperatures are just about always above 30 degrees – there is a big difference between a 39 degree day here and a 39 degree day in Townsville, for example.
Yeah, so you've just answered your own question there, Matt. That's why there isn't a specific temperature put down in the policy to say this is where a race meeting finishes because of the difference. It's a massive state Queensland and what 39 in Cairns might mean as distinct from 39 at the Gold Coast, as distinct from 39 at Bedourie or something, they're vastly different temperature or climate type of arrangements. So that's why specifically and very purposefully, a temperature wasn't put in there, which meant that a race meeting had to be cancelled because we didn't want to tie people down to individual climates that might work in one and don't work in another. So that's why there's a discretion there if you like. Mitigation measures are in place and if the stewards or another party deem that a race meeting cannot continue without compromising welfare and safety, then they'll make that determination at the time.
Is there a meeting between QRIC and Racing Queensland tomorrow to discuss the Adverse Weather Policy?
Yes. Tomorrow morning.
There's concern from the industry that there are no industry representatives in that meeting and haven't been afforded the opportunity to provide feedback on the policy. Certainly, the vets that regularly frequent the bush meetings say to me that they haven't been contacted. Shouldn't we get more data and more information before changing the policy?
I can unequivocally guarantee that there's a good deal of data and a good deal of information that's been provided by the various parties around the state. Whether that is drilled down to individual vets, you know, I certainly can't give any opinion on that or any clarification on that. But you can be sure that people who frequent these race meetings on a regular basis, on a constant basis, have been spoken to regarding the matter. And tomorrow's meeting isn't a defining meeting as to say, we're meeting about this and there'll be no further meetings about this on this subject going forward. Tomorrow is a meeting in advance of the policy being implemented to discuss the matter. If there are issues that are raised tomorrow that require more general industry consultation, then that's available to us. Tomorrow's meeting isn't a line in the sand that says that there'll be nothing that occurs after that. So I don't think that there should be any fear that what happens tomorrow is necessarily the final step in the process.
But just to clarify, you did say at the start of the conversation, and I just want to make sure I heard correctly, you believe there'll be a new document policy produced in the next week or so?
I hope so. I hope that'll be the case. I hope that it might even be as early as tomorrow, but I would think it would probably be the week after. And that is my hope that that occurs for sure.
I read stewards' reports regularly and I attend meetings in the bush regularly. I can't recall ever seeing in a stewards' report – certainly not in North West Queensland – about horses suffering as a result of the heat. There are concerns, I guess, in the North West and Central West that race meetings are going to be either pushed to 9 o'clock in the morning or outside of regular times to what the industry is calling "rationalisation by stealth". Therefore, you won't have to race in the shoulder seasons anymore. Currently, we only race from the end of February to the end of November. Could the racing season become even shorter if this heat policy is changed dramatically?
For every circumstance that you're mentioning there where you can't recall one being reported as having heat stress, then I'll find you another one at various times over the summer period and even the spring and autumn either side where horses are reported to have post-race distress. So I don't necessarily know or believe that it should be confined to one particular area and just whatever has happened in the past there continues into the future. One thing I can tell you, Matt, is that if a policy like this is not implemented and is not wisely put into practice, then if there was to be an incident where a horse met an unfortunate outcome or a participant, particularly a jockey, was to happen to meet an unfortunate outcome, well then the industry runs the jeopardy of a policy being forced on them by people perhaps outside of the industry. I think it's surely better for the industry to look at these matters, to review these matters, and to ask themselves the question: Is it still acceptable for animals to be racing at a certain temperature without mitigation measures being considered as options?
And the answer to that, my very clear answer to that is no, it is not. We've got an obligation to protect the animals and to protect the participants. And if that means that we have to put in place measures that are going to provide for that, then I won't step away from that.
That's completely fair. I think there's concern from the industry that there's been a lack of consultation.
No, I don't accept that, Matt. I don't accept that. I think that the data and temperatures and all of the necessary factors have been considered. This isn't just a piece of work that was started last week and put into place next week. This has been an ongoing matter that has probably taken the best part of a year. And in fact, the Country (Racing Panel) was spoken to directly by me. I can't remember what the date was, but it was a number of months ago, advising them that this matter was being looked at and this policy was being prepared to be put in place for this summer. That was a meeting of all the country clubs from around Queensland. I don't accept that this is a new piece of work that is suddenly being sprung on the industry without notice. And I wouldn't describe it as necessarily a new piece of work.
I mean, there was an existing Caring for Racing Animals in Extreme Heat Policy. And this is just, I suppose, another reiteration of that, perhaps a more comprehensive reiteration of that. But it's a more comprehensive iteration because it needs to be. We need to adapt with the times, to acknowledge heat, to acknowledge animals racing in that heat, and to make sure that we've got the necessary measures in place to make sure that those matters are protected or those issues are protected, but also being pragmatic about it and trying to, wherever possible, ensure that a race meeting goes ahead.
I'll give you another demonstration of that in operation. Late last year, I went out to Longreach and with Cath Clark, who's the QRIC commissioner and Chantal Raine, the deputy commissioner, and we were in Longreach for the races on the Saturday. And it was on Saturday morning, it was raised that it was going to be extremely hot that afternoon, it might have even been the Friday, I'm sorry, that it was going to be extremely hot on the Saturday and that the veterinarians had concerns regarding the race meeting being conducted. Fortunately, I was out there and I was able to work with the veterinarians, work with the club, and what we ended up doing was changing it from the Saturday to the Sunday morning.
We flipped the program basically on its head in that we had the longer races earlier and the shorter races later and we ran the last race on or about 11 o'clock. The temperature at that stage was nudging 39 at 11 o'clock in the morning. So the industry was able to benefit by the race meeting being held, the club was able to benefit by the race meeting being held, but the welfare and the safety of the participants was not compromised and was able to be put into place. That's effective management of a race meeting and that's effective regulation of a race meeting, taking into consideration all the necessary weather implications.
Look, I'd like to hear back from you this afternoon, but my question is, why was the same protocol not done with the Barcaldine meeting?
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Kim Kelly calls back less than two hours later
KK: Now, in respect to the Barcaldine meeting, I suppose its genesis was two weeks prior at Blackall. The vet who was at that race meeting made a comment to (QRIC steward) Russell Hanson that it was getting quite warm. There were no concerns over the race meeting but that it was getting quite warm and just raised those preliminary concerns.
But more to the point James Baker, a jockey, was taken to hospital displaying symptoms of heat exhaustion. So, based on the back of those discussions, we then discussed the upcoming Isisford race meeting. In respect of the Isisford meeting, it was brought forward to have the first race at 11 o'clock and the last race at 1.20 because it was tipped to be 43 in the peak of the day. And that was what took place.
As far as Russell Hansen is concerned, the club was happy with that outcome and that everybody, as far as I know, everybody was pleased with the outcome there. First race at 11, last race at 1.20. So based on that, the following day, that's Sunday, the president of Barcaldine, Willie Chandler, reached out to Russell Hanson to say, can we do something similar? So then the wheels were put in motion to put the first race at about 11 o'clock with the last race at about the same time. Now there was a discussion then subsequent to that, that took place, I think on Tuesday, where it was decided that due to the vet attendance and the jockeys, because the flight was getting in at quarter past 11, whether the meeting could be pushed back further towards midday.
It was decided, and QRIC were a part of that process, that no, we could not do that because that's pushing the meeting into the heat of the day. And if there was a delay to the flight, it wouldn't achieve anything anyway.
MN: But this meeting is starting at 10, not 11.
I'm getting to that. So it was decided, bearing in mind that the riders wouldn't be there for at least the first half of the program, that it would be best to get as far away from the heat as possible. And it was decided to have the first race at 10 o'clock and the last race at 12 o'clock, because the vet service at Clermont was engaged to service the meeting, and they could do 10 o'clock in the morning. As it turns out, David the vet is coming back in time, but irrespective of whether David was going to be available, the vet clinic, at a cost, was available from Clermont to service the race meeting.
So it was felt that it was best for the first race to be run at 10 o'clock rather than 11 o'clock. Now, if there's any aspect of that process that can be refined to make it a better outcome for the industry, then we'll look at that. But those were the reasons for the decision.
But there was no consultation with the Barcaldine Race Club on that?
Well, look, I don't know about that specific 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock piece. The movement from 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock, as I say, perhaps there could have been more consultation or better lines of communication in respect of that piece itself. And if there is, and I've asked for some information on that, then we'll establish them to make sure that those sort of things are sorted out for the future to make sure that there's full clarity and that all the necessary consultations take place.
But one thing Russell did say is in respect of Matt Gray, he's had two occasions recently where race meetings have had to be put back because he couldn't arrive on time. So if there's a delay to the flight then whatever he's on gets scratched. Those two jockeys, Matt Gray and Minonette Kennedy are flying to Emerald tomorrow and they're driving out. So they'll be available to service the race meeting on Saturday, the full race meeting, rather than just half the race meeting if it was an 11 o'clock start and they stuck to their original flight plans.
What's happening with Cloncurry?
I've spoken to (QRIC North Queensland regional manager) Ross Neal. There was a discussion as to whether they should go early or late. I think the club had a preference to go late, 4pm, because the sun doesn't go down until seven-ish or something like that. My understanding is that those discussions are still taking place, but the first race has been tentatively arranged for 11 o'clock, pending those discussions. Now they will advise sooner rather than later as to what the final determination is. Irrespective of whether it's an 11 o'clock start or a 4 o'clock start, whatever the case may be, QRIC staff and vets will be available to service the meeting. We'll do what we can to make sure that the race meeting proceeds as per normal.
Can I just clarify a couple of things from this morning? You said that you'd spoken at the Country Racing Panel meeting. I've since spoken to people about that. They said that they were told the policy review was happening but they were not asked for any input on that review?
No, I did not. I did not ask them for any input at that stage because at that point I was discussing it with all the stewards and all the necessary stakeholders from within QRIC and that it was still an ongoing piece of work. But I said most certainly that the matter was being reviewed and we'd hopefully have something for them sooner rather than later.
I'm led to believe that members of the Country Racing Panel (Dan Ballard and Gary Peoples) will now be included in the discussion tomorrow.
To be honest with you, I don't know who's attending. Tomorrow's meeting is not the end of the process. So if there are matters raised tomorrow that require further consideration or further consultation, that will happen. That will happen with a degree of urgency because I want this policy up and out there for the public and the industry dissemination as soon as possible, but if that needs to happen, then that's what will happen.